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	<title>Comments on: Live 8</title>
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		<title>By: J Soo</title>
		<link>http://www.noelheikkinen.com/2005/08/04/live-8/comment-page-1/#comment-2351</link>
		<dc:creator>J Soo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Aug 2005 17:24:57 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>The situation in Africa is not more unfathomable than the existance and prevalence of the societal and economic negatives of misery, poverty (relative and absolute), substance misuse, indivudal dislocation, in the &quot;rich and developed&quot; worlds.

It may be as intractable as the above issues sitting next to the seats of global power and material wealth and supposed monopoly on &quot;solutions&quot;.

Relatively we are all the same.

It is not a question of blame but an issue of roles and the effect of actions deliberate or not well intentioned or not.

A majority of power and economic base from which peopel speak from was acquired from universally morally reprehensible methods - currently and for correct reasons denied others. 

is it &quot;deny unto others what you would deny yourself&quot;?

Look comparatively at home first, in your cities and neighbourhoods. Then with less absolutism look out. You may than have something you can bring - a serious new relationship model, because that is what is needed to curb the excesses talked of in Africa at all levels and where you are outside Africa.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The situation in Africa is not more unfathomable than the existance and prevalence of the societal and economic negatives of misery, poverty (relative and absolute), substance misuse, indivudal dislocation, in the &#8220;rich and developed&#8221; worlds.</p>
<p>It may be as intractable as the above issues sitting next to the seats of global power and material wealth and supposed monopoly on &#8220;solutions&#8221;.</p>
<p>Relatively we are all the same.</p>
<p>It is not a question of blame but an issue of roles and the effect of actions deliberate or not well intentioned or not.</p>
<p>A majority of power and economic base from which peopel speak from was acquired from universally morally reprehensible methods &#8211; currently and for correct reasons denied others. </p>
<p>is it &#8220;deny unto others what you would deny yourself&#8221;?</p>
<p>Look comparatively at home first, in your cities and neighbourhoods. Then with less absolutism look out. You may than have something you can bring &#8211; a serious new relationship model, because that is what is needed to curb the excesses talked of in Africa at all levels and where you are outside Africa.</p>
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		<title>By: dan</title>
		<link>http://www.noelheikkinen.com/2005/08/04/live-8/comment-page-1/#comment-2350</link>
		<dc:creator>dan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Aug 2005 06:41:32 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>yeah good comment Travis.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>yeah good comment Travis.</p>
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		<title>By: Noel</title>
		<link>http://www.noelheikkinen.com/2005/08/04/live-8/comment-page-1/#comment-2349</link>
		<dc:creator>Noel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Aug 2005 21:36:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.noelheikkinen.com/?p=1235#comment-2349</guid>
		<description>Always good to be reminded to have balance.  Thanks for that, Travis.

I would love to borrow that book from you some time.  Sounds like a great read and probably timely, as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Always good to be reminded to have balance.  Thanks for that, Travis.</p>
<p>I would love to borrow that book from you some time.  Sounds like a great read and probably timely, as well.</p>
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		<title>By: travis</title>
		<link>http://www.noelheikkinen.com/2005/08/04/live-8/comment-page-1/#comment-2348</link>
		<dc:creator>travis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Aug 2005 21:05:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.noelheikkinen.com/?p=1235#comment-2348</guid>
		<description>Did you see &lt;a href=&quot;http://missionsafari.typepad.com/mission_safari/2005/07/keith_a_mission.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;the follow-up post on July 20th&lt;/a&gt; due to a response he received from another missionary?  The writer Bolt links to in that follow-up provides a much wider perspective &lt;a href=&quot;http://voiceinthedesert.netfirms.com/keith/archives/2005/06/g8_blogging_1_a.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;through five essays&lt;/a&gt; that examine in some more detail issues of &#039;western&#039; corruption and the effects of aid/debt cancellation in countries other than just Kenya.  I agree with this statement he made:  &quot;&lt;i&gt;Unfortunately, people tend to reduce such arguments to either/or, when it is both-and.&lt;/i&gt;&quot;  I don&#039;t believe the troubles in Africa are all &#039;our&#039; fault or all &#039;their&#039; fault.

I think in his initial piece, Bolt overlooks a lot of history that is relevant to the situation at hand.  For starters, there&#039;s the slave trade period.  Then there was the subsequent colonization following the 1885 Berlin Conference.  Selfish, &quot;ends justify means&quot; US Cold War policy of funding militaristic, dictatorships or power-consolidating regimes (like in Iraq...) is also a factor to be considered.  Environmental conditions, farming policies, women&#039;s roles, etc.  Keith does touch on some of these, but I think even his just spots the iceberg for us . . .

This reminds me of the class I took a few years ago on Africa while at MSU.  Initially I thought it would be stupid, but it turned out to be very interesting and helped reveal a lot I didn&#039;t know about my own attitudes toward Africa and those generally held by the society I live in at large  (even why I assumed it would be stupid from the outset).  The textbook from that class &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1555878504/qid=1123523514/sr=8-1/ref=pd_bbs_sbs_1/103-4603088-0930262?v=glance&amp;s=books&amp;n=507846&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Understanding Contemporary Africa&lt;/a&gt; seemed to do a great job of introducing me to Africa -- what exactly it is, who the many different people can be there, and the many perspectives on &lt;b&gt;why&lt;/b&gt;.  I still have it, actually.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Did you see <a href="http://missionsafari.typepad.com/mission_safari/2005/07/keith_a_mission.html" rel="nofollow">the follow-up post on July 20th</a> due to a response he received from another missionary?  The writer Bolt links to in that follow-up provides a much wider perspective <a href="http://voiceinthedesert.netfirms.com/keith/archives/2005/06/g8_blogging_1_a.html" rel="nofollow">through five essays</a> that examine in some more detail issues of &#8216;western&#8217; corruption and the effects of aid/debt cancellation in countries other than just Kenya.  I agree with this statement he made:  &#8220;<i>Unfortunately, people tend to reduce such arguments to either/or, when it is both-and.</i>&#8221;  I don&#8217;t believe the troubles in Africa are all &#8216;our&#8217; fault or all &#8216;their&#8217; fault.</p>
<p>I think in his initial piece, Bolt overlooks a lot of history that is relevant to the situation at hand.  For starters, there&#8217;s the slave trade period.  Then there was the subsequent colonization following the 1885 Berlin Conference.  Selfish, &#8220;ends justify means&#8221; US Cold War policy of funding militaristic, dictatorships or power-consolidating regimes (like in Iraq&#8230;) is also a factor to be considered.  Environmental conditions, farming policies, women&#8217;s roles, etc.  Keith does touch on some of these, but I think even his just spots the iceberg for us . . .</p>
<p>This reminds me of the class I took a few years ago on Africa while at MSU.  Initially I thought it would be stupid, but it turned out to be very interesting and helped reveal a lot I didn&#8217;t know about my own attitudes toward Africa and those generally held by the society I live in at large  (even why I assumed it would be stupid from the outset).  The textbook from that class <a href="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1555878504/qid=1123523514/sr=8-1/ref=pd_bbs_sbs_1/103-4603088-0930262?v=glance&amp;s=books&amp;n=507846" rel="nofollow">Understanding Contemporary Africa</a> seemed to do a great job of introducing me to Africa &#8212; what exactly it is, who the many different people can be there, and the many perspectives on <b>why</b>.  I still have it, actually.</p>
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